This image by no means intimates that I believe Lazy Gardens is an accountant. But she does cook the books.I was sent via email a copy of a comment that Lazy Gardens put on Tracy, FRAUD INVESTIGATOR’S, site. You would think Tracy would investigate the possibility of this fraud, but apparently not. Here is the comment:
LazyGardens
Throwing more fuel on the fire … how would you like to take a $45,000 pay cut? Here’s some numbers from January 2006 versus January 2007, from Applause (lest you think I’m pulling numbers out of my nether regions).These NSDs (nervous, sweating, desperate) were from the “ON TARGET” for inner circle listing, so they should be the very best that MK has. I deleted those who didn’t show up in both years.I subtracted the 2006 NSD income from the 2007 income to see what was happening. Negative means the 2007 income was smaller than in 2006.
Patricia Rodríguez-Turker . . . . -45,280.52
Jana Cox . . . . -39,477.18
Darlene Berggren . . . . -34,537.75
Lupita Ceballos . . . . -34,024.25
Gloria Castaño . . . . -27,868.51
Gloria Mayfield Banks . . . . -12,796.43
Cheryl Warfield . . . . -12,262.78
Julianne Nagle . . . . -12,134.76
Tammy Crayk . . . . -12,059.37
Barbara Sunden . . . . -8,630.79
Kerry Buskirk . . . . -5,996.14
Valerie Bagnol . . . . -4,836.26
Joyce Z. Grady . . . . -2,611.76
Joan Chadbourn . . . . -851.74
Joanne Holman . . . . 142.12
Margaret Winner . . . . 2,228.01
Nancy Bonner . . . . 2,645.14
Pat Danforth . . . . 3,176.56
Rosa Jackson . . . . 4,171.79
Mary Diem . . . . 4,746.60
Wanda Dalby . . . . 4,900.15
Jeanne Rowland . . . . 5,848.72
Dawn Dunn . . . . 6,353.08
SuzAnne Brothers . . . . 6,355.57
Ronnie D’Esposito Klein . . . . 7,421.02
Anita Mallory Garrett-Roe . . . . 8,630.19
Lisa Madson . . . . 8,807.53
Kathy Z. Rasmussen . . . . 9,133.80
Holly Zick . . . . 9,414.89
Shirley Oppenheimer . . . . 9,890.01
Johnnette Shealy . . . . 9,949.67
Judie McCoy . . . . 10,120.53
Debi Moore . . . . 10,543.16
Jackie Swank . . . . 10,781.60
Maureen Ledda . . . . 11,558.12
Sue Kirkpatrick . . . . 12,006.21
Linda Toupin . . . . 13,341.06
Karen Piro . . . . 13,377.29
Sherry Giancristoforo . . . . 13,620.61
Doris Jannke . . . . 14,456.29
Sonya LaVay . . . . 15,427.51
Elizabeth Fitzpatrick . . . . 15,705.69
Jo Anne Cunnington . . . . 16,742.33
Anita Tripp Brewton . . . . 17,775.60
Nan Stroud . . . . 18,714.88
Pam Gruber . . . . 19,072.23
Nancy Perry-Miles . . . . 20,390.50
Cindy Williams . . . . 20,592.62
Linda McBroom . . . . 21,010.99
Jan Harris . . . . 22,907.06
Rena Tarbet . . . . 24,199.28
Kay Elvrum . . . . 25,215.66
Gayle Gaston . . . . 25,730.10
Mary Cane . . . . 26,490.67
Diane Underwood . . . . 27,386.06
Kathy Helou . . . . 28,893.10
Stacy James . . . . 29,668.22
Ronda Burnside . . . . 29,947.59
Carol Anton . . . . 30,824.05
Christine Peterson . . . . 31,991.47
Scarlett Walker . . . . 35,697.91
Pamela Waldrop Shaw . . . . 38,044.56
Karlee Isenhart . . . . 47,077.89
I wondered where she got these numbers so I got out my Applause magazines from the months in question and looked them up. Just comparing them by sight didn’t seem to confirm her numbers so I pulled up Excel and did my own spreadsheet. If you are guessing that her numbers are wrong, you win the prize. Here is my spreadsheet:
Name 2006 2007 Diff LG #
Newberry 263,956.87 269,363.59 5406.72
Sunden 205,697.41 201,177.50 -4,519.91 -8,630.79
Fortenberry 193,906.40 182,273.66 -11,632.74
Gaston 177,751.07 167,172.82 -10,578.25 25,730.10
Peterson 172,335.84 152,630.74 -19,705.10 31,991.47
Anton 153,671.10 136,745.22 -16,925.88 30,824.05
Helou 130,627.96 124,252.36 -6,375.60 28,893.10
Piro 129,567.62 130,115.63 548.01 13,377.29
Harris 126,298.52 111,959.48 -14,339.04 22,907.06
Madson 122,073.71 120,461.46 -1,612.25 8,807.53
Stroud 121,935.66 114,002.86 -7,932.80 18,714.88
M.Banks 114,017.21 108,815.72 -5,201.49 -12,796.43
Tarbet 113,118.77 102,092.26 -11,026.51 24,199.28
Isenhart 109,733.58 86,888.88 -22,844.70 47,077.89
Holman 109,493.97 123,642.73 14,148.76 142.12
Burnside 98,691.77 82,174.15 -16,517.62 29,947.59
James 97,526.27 78,475.33 -19,050.94 29,668.22
Warfield 94,966.56 108,816.41 13,849.85 -12,262.78
Danforth 94,516.23 95,819.48 1,303.25 3,176.56
McBroom 92,160.73 86,229.47 -5,931.26 21,010.99
Payan 89,168.94 86,043.07 -3,125.87
Giancristoforo 88,130.48 77,689.32 -10,441.16 13,620.61
Shealy 85,201.55 79,821.82 -5,379.73 9,949.67
Rasmussen 84,698.12 79,448.73 -5,249.39 9,133.80
Ceballos 84,251.01 95,971.93 11,720.92 -34,024.25
Nagle 84,075.80 92,156.19 8,080.39 -12,134.76
Zick 83,548.73 82,614.26 -934.47 9,414.89
Enriquez 81,659.15 87,622.95 5,963.80
Kirkpatrick 78,995.59 74,371.62 -4,623.97 12,006.21
Shaw 77,379.30 64,543.17 -12,836.13 38,044.56
Moore 75,423.62 68,218.29 -7,205.33 10,543.16
Chadbourn 75,224.35 77,634.60 2,410.25 -851.74
Janike 74,871.71 66,601.22 -8,270.49 14,456.29
Williams 73,680.31 74,179.19 498.88 20,592.62
Diem 72,846.06 70,990.37 -1,855.69 4,746.60
Toupin 71,409.12 60,487.48 -10,921.64 13,341.06
Oppenheimer 71,284.86 64,762.86 -6,522.00 9,890.01
Berggren 70,277.18 76,694.22 6,417.04 -34,537.75
Brothers 68,860.05 62,516.14 -6,343.91 6,355.57
McCoy 68,736.20 65,670.38 -3,065.82 10,120.53
Perry Miles 67,605.27 56,936.40 -10,668.87 20,390.50
Garrett-Roe 66,991.28 60,934.13 -6,057.15 8,630.19
Swank 66,981.21 62,898.37 -4,082.84 10,781.60
Rowland 66,750.22 66,523.67 -226.55 5,848.72
Buskirk 65,959.58 66,604.64 645.06 -5,996.14
Gruber 65,872.64 61,355.74 -4,516.90 19,072.23
Brock 65,786.87 55,339.25 -10,447.62
LaVay 65,222.89 57,048.20 -8,174.69 15,427.51
Floberg 64,952.57 72,699.66 7,747.09
Reiters 64,620.17 59,067.86 -5,552.31 4,171.79
Jackson 64,566.24 65,538.55 972.31
Dalby 63,865.70 58,039.61 -5,826.09 4,900.15
Underwood 63,651.88 54,844.81 -8,807.07 27,386.06
D’Esposito 59,152.16 57,749.11 -1,403.05 7,421.02
Bonner 57,957.21 54,702.05 -3,255.16 2,645.14
Sibert 56,830.37 50,139.83 -6,690.54
Crayk 56,403.20 62,362.12 5,958.92 -12,059.37
Rodriguez-Turker 52,159.27 72,630.25 20,470.98 -45,280.52
Grady 50,365.31 54,635.09 4,269.78 -2,611.76
Newton 50,309.45 60,826.91 10,517.46 Totals -215,749.06 -417.094.44
Others included in LG’s numbers are listed below. These ladies are not listed in the On Target Diamond list for either year. Where LG got these numbers (and names) from is anyone’s guess. Perhaps from her nether regions?
Jana Cox . . . -39,477.18
Valerie Bagnol . . . . -4,836.26
Margaret Winner . . . . 2,228.01
Gloria Castaño . . . . -27,868.51 .
Dawn Dunn . . . . 6,353.08
Maureen Ledda . . . . 11,558.12 Elizabeth Fitzpatrick . . . . 15,705.69 Jo Anne Cunnington . . . . 16,742.33 Anita Tripp Brewton . . . . 17,775.60
Kay Elvrum . . . . 25,215.66
Scarlett Walker . . . . 35,697.91
Mary Cane . . . . 26,490.67
Where did Lazy Gardens get her numbers? Don’t know. Why did she leave off several NSDs (including Ann Newberry and Pat Fortenberry) but put in others that were not shown either year? I don’t know. Where did Lazy Gardens get any numbers at all? She has never been a consultant. And please notice that P. Rodriguez-Turker did not take a $45,000 pay cut, but in fact is $20,000 ahead of where she was last year.I haven’t visited PT’s site to see what the responses were to Lazy Garden’s book cooking, but I can only imagine they are all discussing it like it was the gospel.
So many factors come into play with trying to compare numbers like this. NSDs retire, or there are new NSDs to debut from existing areas and the numbers will reflect that. But at the very base, you can see that Lazy Gardens predicts that twice as much money was “not made” as the real numbers show. Does my chart show that sales are down? No. My chart shows that money was distributed elsewhere from 2006. Like LG says she did (but who knows what she really did), I did not list NSDs that were not reflected on both years. That would allow for the negative number in my total.
105 comments
Comments feed for this article
February 24, 2007 at 3:28 pm
lazygardens
I got them from the section called “Year-to-date NSD Gross Commissions as of January 2007″ and another Applause that listed the income from the NSDs for the same time period in 2006.
If different Applause magazines are showing different figures, that’s a proofreading or accounting problem for MK corporate.
February 24, 2007 at 4:18 pm
Me
You are a liar. That information is not in an Applause magazine. The sheet you cite from 2007 is on the NSD Suite on In Touch. The 2006 figures are not there any more.
Since I honor confidentiality requests, I will not publish anything on the NSD Suite. I had to use Applause figures because that is what my readers who are consultants would have access to. I used the On Target Diamond figures to get my results. I used real figures to get real results and I did it in an honorable, ethical way.
Nice try, LG, but not only do you make up all the statistics you throw around, but you try to blame it on corporate.
February 24, 2007 at 8:49 pm
PinkandProud
Just a wild guess, but LG was probably not a math major.
February 24, 2007 at 9:05 pm
NPH
Why do you care so much “me”?
February 24, 2007 at 9:31 pm
Me
Why do I care? I can’t believe you really asked me that. Because some moron is posting bogus figures and claiming them to be true, and then lies about where she got her numbers. Because the regulars that support Tracy swallow whatever is posted there as the truth and somebody should point out the lies and manipulation.
Why do YOU care? You sent your product back, you’re out and never have to wear pantyhose again. Why should you care about it now?
February 24, 2007 at 11:21 pm
Rebecca
Oh, my, my, my. Where and how and why does Lazy Gardens have access to the NSD Suite? Has somebody hacked into a computer?
Impressive - NOT.
February 25, 2007 at 11:45 am
Rebecca
And yet another from Lazy Gardens;
A great “why I’m quitting Mary Kay” letter
Comment #71 by Lazy Gardens
“Peer pressure and manipulation can make people do things that are not in their best interest.”
(end quote)
Naturally this comment is actually very very long but this particular sentence stood out to me.
I don’t know about you all, but —- I learned how to deal with, and combat, “peer pressure and manipulation” in junior high and high school, even in elementary school.
February 25, 2007 at 11:50 am
Me
It was probably high school for me, but early in!
February 25, 2007 at 8:14 pm
PinkandProud
NPH, Me has asked a great question of you. If you are out and have received your precious Blue Check, why don’t you just move on with your life? Surely you have one……..LOL
February 25, 2007 at 10:59 pm
foreverpink
that is a question for all of them! Why do they care about what products are coming out..why do they care about how much directors and nationals really make..why do the care about who is debuting or winning their car etc. Its like they still want to be a part of mary kay somehow. I dont understand it. Can someone explain it?
February 26, 2007 at 10:04 am
mkrealist
Forever Pink says ~
…they care about what products are coming out…
…they care about how much directors and nationals really make…
…they care about who is debuting or winning their car etc…
…they still want to be a part of mary kay somehow…
ForeverPink asks ~ Can someone explain it?
I think you just did.
February 26, 2007 at 10:47 am
PinkandProud
There is no rational explanation. They are the thing they say they hate the most.
February 26, 2007 at 12:44 pm
Judi
Forever Pink, do you feel passionate about something in this world that you believe to be totally and completely wrong? Maybe a political issue, a medical cause, etc? Maybe you worked for an unethical corporation and still have friends employed there and you like to know what’s going on because you know that things either one day will change or come to a complete end? That’s the way many ex-mkers feel. Not with bitterness, but with active interest in the status of company’s policies, directors, procedures, etc.
I worked for a company that was doing some very shady things. I, and several long-time employees, ended up leaving (not by choice) and we spoke loud and long to the powers that be about all the things that were wrong. Just recently the person who made all of the horrible decisions was demoted. Our voices were heard. We were not bitter and angry, we wanted to see justice done.
Now I know that the nature of this board will be to attack me for losing my job last summer. Have at it. It will show your true colors and the fact that you’re incapable of understanding a valid point being made.
February 26, 2007 at 6:27 pm
Me
I would never attack you for losing your job. I have been laid off three times in a row–talk about a slam to your ego. Even though I lost my job through no fault of my own (reorganizing, downsizing or in one case, the company closed) it is still a slam.
The difference between your scenario above and that of MK is two-fold. You can get in and out of MK any time you want and you are an independent contractor. That means you can run your business pretty much any way you want. If you work for a company, more than likely you are stuck there until you find something else and there are a lot of other factors involved.
But the difference between your scenario above and what you and all the other anti-MKers do is this: you say “not with bitterness”. All the comments I have seen are bitter, mean, hateful and sometimes evil. The scenario at your former employer apparently depended on one person making bad decisions (”the person who made all of the horrible decisions was demoted”). Mary Kay is what it is and was what it was when all of those people MADE THE CHOICE TO SIGN UP. There is not one person managing everyone. Again, we are independent contractors.
You do not make a valid point at all. You are trying to justify the bitter, mean, hateful and sometimes evil behavior of a bunch of women you don’t even know. A bunch of women who apparently want what MK has to offer and didn’t cut it, so they criticize it. I honestly don’t know if you post there or not, Judi–I have seen comments from you here (those that made it on the blog and those that did not) but I am assuming you are affiliated with the Tracy crowd, from what you say in defense of them.
February 26, 2007 at 8:31 pm
foreverpink
Judi..I dont even know where to begin when it comes to replying to your comment. I can only describe the feelings that I have right now after reading it. I feel shocked, hurt and confused to say the least. I dont even know you, but you have really struck a cord with me by what you have written. But make no mistake about it…I dont feel this way because I agree with anything that you have said. Rather I disagree with you so much that I really have to choose my words in order to keep from typing something that I might have to take back. And I will try hard not to use any caps, because I want to watch my blog manners..
With that said..
This is the second time that I have read something from you that either indicates that your are totaly blind to the goings of the Pink Truth blog or you just dont know the meaning of the word “bitter”. I think that it must be the latter since you keep accusing us of being bitter while completely overlooking the comments made at PT. Why do you keep accusing us of being bitter? We have nothing to be bitter about in MK. Each of us are satisfied with the way our businesses are going right now. If we are not where we want to be, we know what we must do to change it. We are not the ones complaining because things did not turn out the way we planned. Complaints, pitty parties, anger, being rude and saying mean catty remarks are born out of bitterness. The quest for revenge is born out of bitterness. You cannot tell me that the ladies at PT are not out for revenge. Now, whether or not they deserve revenge is another story. But you cannot feel that way unless you are bitter. Perhaps you do not see them as the being bitter or hateful because you actually agree with them and their efforts. Otherwise I dont see how you could even fix your fingers to type the words “not with bitterness” when referring to them. You MUST BE reading a different blog. (oops sorry about the caps!) Do you not consider the PT crowd bitter? Please tell me? We are often held up to a double standard when it comes to the way we feel about this whole Mary Kay blogging thing. People like you Judi, will think it is perfectly ok for PT followers to say whatever they want, threaten others, and just be out and out hateful. You justify what they say and do. But as soon as we defend our businesses on blogs like this one and challenge the things that are being written about us or said..all of a sudden you cry foul. But like I said to you in a previous reply,”I guess their brand of hateful is ok with you”
Secondly, as someone who has been laid off before myself, I would never make fun of or ridicule someone for loosing a job. It aint fun and collecting unemployment is for the birds! It is not the “nature of this board” to personnally attack someone for a misfortune like that. But rather PT posters make personal attacks on NSD’s and top directors all the time, so once again it seems that you are willfully disgregarding the activity on that blog in order to accuse us of what they do on any given day. I personnaly wrote a post indicating that I hoped that Queenie Jeanie, who is a regular on the PT blog and an avid mk basher, will be able to be reunited with her husband soon who is, by several reports, serving in Iraq. Even though she is as hateful as she can be..no one wishes any thing to happen to her family with this war and we have said so. But I guess you didnt see that post did you? You are too busy defending people who wish us harm.
And as far as your analogy of the unethical corporation..I worked for one.. for six years. I had situations in which I had to complain about my supervisor, I reported unethical behavior and I finally had enough so I looked for another job. No.. rather I PRAYED for another job. The Lord granted it and I quit. I ended up getting a better paying job with better hours and great benefits. But guess what..I could care less about what is going on over there. I moved on and I did not want anything else to do with that place. Except for my old customers that I had there, I dont have anything else to do with them. I am not interested, I dont keep up with the corporate goings on or whatever. Why should I..I have moved on. And those that still want to work there, let em stay. I hope they get what they want from it. I dont have to burden myself with what will come of that company, because if they keep operating in a shady or unethical way..it will either have to change or it will bring itself down on its own. I feel that it is the same with MK. If it is so unethical and shady..it will come down on its own without the help of Tracy or whoever else is mad because they did not get what they wanted out of MK. But after 40 years..I really dont think that Tracy or any other anti mk person can do what time couldn’t.
February 26, 2007 at 8:41 pm
Me
Bravo, foreverpink, Bravo!!!! I am clapping and cheering at all you said!
Thank you for taking the time to post it!
Changing the subject, I wonder why Lazy Gardens hasn’t been back blasting me for calling her a liar.
I think it’s because she IS one and there is no defense for her. Imagine….Lazy Gardens speechless!!
February 26, 2007 at 9:49 pm
Rebecca
Me, I have noticed that Lazy Gardens goes speechless when she has been proven wrong. Or her bluff is called.
She went totally silent when we asked for the “study” she did - even though she did offer it to us.
It has been proven that this current information of hers did NOT come from wence she claims. Once again - total silence.
February 26, 2007 at 9:55 pm
Rebecca
Regarding the company she worked for that did some very shady things, Judi says, “…we spoke loud and long to the powers that be about all the things that were wrong.”
Point - “to the powers that be”. Neither Tracy Coenen, nor her Pink Truth site are “the powers that be” regarding Mary Kay. She has absolutely no power and no authority to do anything about anything involving Mary Kay. She and her followers are NOT “the powers that be”. Her web site and discussion board are NOT the place to voice the complaints and/or concerns; she and her followers are NOT the people who can bring about any changes. Actually, they are not even the ones who get to decide if any changes even need to be made.
February 26, 2007 at 10:08 pm
Rebecca
Me, I do remember seeing this comment of LG’s on PT but now I can’t find it. Is it still there (where ever it is?) or is it now gone?
February 26, 2007 at 10:12 pm
turningpink
“Judi” said “That’s the way many ex-mkers feel. Not with bitterness, but with active interest in the status of company’s policies, directors, procedures, etc.”
Okay, so maybe they aren’t bitter…I think the word spiteful is better suited anyway.
bit·ter: resentful or cynical
Spiteful implies a mean or malicious desire for (often petty) revenge
There is quite a difference between taking an “active interest” and actively bashing anything, everything, and everyone associated with MK.
Turn this around for just a moment. Do you like your job? If you do, are you proud of the work you do? If you are, how would you feel if someone told you that because they used to have that job and hated it that you should hate it too? What if they said they knew someone who had been in your position that had done something unethical, so you MUST be unethical too? How would that make you feel? What if they said they were trying to take your job away? What would your response be?
This is precisely what PT is doing, but I suppose we are all just bitter for taking a stand for something that we love. We are just supposed to give up our dreams “because they say so.” Maybe I am bitter. At least I’m not spiteful.
February 27, 2007 at 5:18 am
Me
Very, very good points ladies!
February 27, 2007 at 9:44 am
Linda
Hmmm… even so… let’s use LazyGarden’s numbers… just for fun!
By adding up all of LG’s numbers and dividing by the amount of people listed, the average GAIN from one January to the other was $8,726.31 (the total of $549,757.45 divided by 63 ladies)
Now… from the 14 ladies (only 22.22% of the list) who are listed as having a loss, the average loss was .
From the remaining 49 ladies (77.78%) listed as gaining, the average gain was $16,390.32.
Let’s see… if we flip the list so the gains are listed at the top, then we can name it similiar to how LG named her article… “How would you like to get a $47,000 raise?”
February 27, 2007 at 9:46 am
Linda
Oh my… the loss number disappeared… it was $3,234.32
February 27, 2007 at 6:50 pm
Anna-Laura
For the love of Pete and all that is holy! Why does someone who doesn’t like MK, its consultants, or its products feel the need to discourage those of us who are happy with our lives, products, consultants, directors? It’s like a woman who discovers she’s a lesbian and then spends all her time trying to convince the rest of the female population that all men suck. NOTE: I’m not slamming lesbians here. They love makeup and skincare too. I’ve also known at least one who made a good living with MK.
March 3, 2007 at 8:23 am
PinkandProud
Here is more hypocrisy from LazyGardens.
LazyGardens
So “name them and shame them” has replaced “name it and claim it”?
Comment left at 7:42 am on 2 Mar 2007
Um, name then and shame them? Isn’t that exactly what the PT loons do? Having been on the receiving end of their childish and outlandish wrath more than once, I can attest to the fact they are definitely hypocrites.
April 19, 2007 at 7:51 pm
Retired NSD
Tracey Coenen is making stories again to brainwash the MK salesforce.
If she really is free from the PINK why does she have to make a website
against the company?
It is her choice whether she will join the opportunity or not.
She has no right to bash other people’s lives.
Thousands of women have benefited the Mary Kay Co.
They see their lives enriched.
Why destroy a company who aims to help peoples lives?
What does she mean, the company is selfish? Mary Kay has helped thousands of people during Katrina and the cancer victims.
Why blame the company? It is her fault she didn’t make it to the top.
April 20, 2007 at 10:47 am
Anonymous Please
She has the site for a couple reasons:
a) For the attention. She is the hero and she loves/needs the adulation.
b) She is a bully. This is the best place for her to push others around and not get hurt herself.
c). Money. Plain and simple.
d) She started the message board to compete with Pink Lighthouse. She can’t even come close. Her board is angry and ugly and Pink Lighthouse is about helping and moving on and growing as a person.
e) Sad, very very sad.
April 20, 2007 at 8:39 pm
colleen
What do you mean anonymous please by she cant compete with Pinklighthouse? PT seems to get more traffic and ME is right the ladies on Pink lighthouse do seem to be nicer and have their head on straight. Again Im not bashing any of these sites just making an observation. Pinklighthouse actually has some good topics on cooking and TV and things like that..they really do. Again not promoting anti sites (have to be careful these days I dont want to be the Don Imus) of any board.
April 21, 2007 at 2:13 am
Anonymous Please
I guess I mean can’t compete as far as the way her site will have a positive affect on lives. If you visit Pink Lighthouse, you will find that the women have formed friendships beyond their MK experience and the discusssions prove that. There are still MK topics of course, but it goes deeper.
If you read PT, you will find the same people posting over and over again to keep the traffic looking flush. Plus, you now have to register to read some of the topics. People will do that out of curiosity and again it makes the membership look greater than it is.
PT keeps women who have had bad experiences in the pit of despair. Lighthouse lifts them up, brushes them off and helps them move forward. Huge difference.
April 21, 2007 at 1:12 pm
colleen
Anonymous please thanks for clarifying I totally agree with you. When you said cant compete I thought you meant number of hits on the site.
April 21, 2007 at 3:41 pm
colleen
Hey Anonymous please over at Pinklighthouse they even have a trading board!! It seems like I remember them not caring if someone who was PRO MK was on their board as long as you werent nasty and empathetic towards their cause. I never joined I really had no reason to but I used to read their postings when I was at work and some of them are still friends with their directors and recruiters after they left MK. If I remember correctly they even had a posting or topic like ‘are you still in MK lets hear what is going on in your business” or something like that. Hmm I guess they are no competition.
April 21, 2007 at 6:31 pm
FreeFromMK
As a PL member, I couldn’t agree more! I, too am concerned about the amount of hatred and “hanging on” that happens at PT. What’s the point of living in anger? Especially considering the events of late, I would think we should all be re-evaluating our purpose and direction in life.
April 22, 2007 at 8:24 am
Anonymous Too
The Pink Lighthouse is great. I go there over PT any day.
July 6, 2007 at 8:58 pm
billionaire
I don’t understand why you ladies are writing stuff about these women, If you did not do well in MK it’s OK maybe it was not for you!
I did Mary Kay for 4 yrs and I did wonderful I did my classes , I did went to my meeting and took guess with me, It was great and I and my team made MONEY , I had two ladies that were in very bad relationship , turn their life around 1. god first , and buliding there self image back up and they both are still in MK and married there husbands are very supportive in their business.
So my point Network marketing is not for everyone and It’s OK Just get over it and move on , You ladies seem so bitter and that’s not GODLY talking bad about these ladies if anything you should pray for them and ask God to change them
Get over it
July 14, 2007 at 11:47 pm
Hypnotist
I am an outsider looking in. Researching for a hypnosis script, I’ve read some stories on Pink Truth and also from this site. Actually, I got here through researching “cult” information–and eventually came upon MLM information, MLM Pyramids, Pink Truth, then here.
Also, I might mention, that I signed up for Mary Kay many years ago, but did not stay in it. I truly didn’t like having to go to all the meetings, and stocking merchandise. However, I have a friend who is in Mary Kay, and she is one of the sweetest and most beautiful people that I know.
I did not leave a comment on Pink Truth, but perhaps I will. The Internet is an amazing way for information to be debated. Amazing.
I know that there is truth on both sides–and certainly two sides (or many sides) to every story.
By the way, my script is on releasing “cultural brainwashing” and “blocks.”
And my research involves nutrition, “fast food,” and the way we are programmed to eat by society and advertising.
My question: Do you feel that the many women telling the stories on PT are not telling the truth about what happened to them? When I read the stories, it was very similar to what happened to me–However, I didn’t go overboard into buying product or anything–I just decided to pursue a different career. And that was many, many years ago when I was in my twenties.
I believed those PK stories, but I always like to check the other perspectives.
Or do you think they are trying to really hurt others with the PK site?
Have those of you who are in the “Pink” actually making real money after expenses? Be honest and let me know. Your replies and attitudes accompanying your replies will help my research.
Thank you and good luck in your life quest–whatever it might be.
July 23, 2007 at 1:36 pm
Accountability...
We are all accountable for our actions, words, decisions, successes and failures. We all know this, yet most people when held accountable to their own failure, lack of effort or dedication - most do the same thing - they blame.
Whenever humans are involved, there will be disagreements, conflicting priorities & cultures & business practices. We all know that you could work with one area in MK, and have a completely different experience than someone working in a different area / for a different NSD.
There are shady people in MK, I’m sure. There are in the church and the White House as well…does it really surprise any of you? Or are you just surprised that you got excited and inspired but YOU realized too late that you didn’t stop & step back to look at it objectively as only one thing: a business?
If an individual (or a group of them) wronged you, cheated you, led you to believe lies or mis-truths…absolutely, shame on them. Do not be a coward…call them up or arrange a face-to-face and tell them how extremely disappointed you are in their lack of leadership or morals, and that it hurts that they ruined the whole big (potentially) rewarding thing for you.
But to blame the entire fabric of MK b/c you did not get the results you wanted?
My story is one of completely rejecting the original recruiter, and talking up the line until I reached someone I felt could align with my needs / desires / morals / business practices. I did not get bitter or upset when my recruiter turned out to be someone like what you all are referring to…I took it upon MYSELF, MY OWNERSHIP of MY BUSINESS all the way up to a 20+ year MK senior director who has lead & coached me well. I make money and have fun. I have helped many other women find a part time income, fun, and friendship. I know in 5, 10, 15 years I will be wealthy if I just keep working the plan my senior director helped me design & helps me run.
I could have blamed my initial recruiter for pressuring me to front load. I could have quit & said MK is a bad MLM enterprise…just like many of you.
But I decided to overcome this (minor) obstacle & run it - MY OWN business - the way I wanted.
Take ownership for your successes, be accountable for your failures.
But I do agree, the very long lovey-dovey emails make me want to vomit…!
So I scrape them off & move on…sounds like good advice for many of you.
July 23, 2007 at 1:58 pm
Me
Accountability, I think we are on the same page. When you say “many of you”, are you speaking to me and those who support me here with their comments? If so, I think you have read us incorrectly.
If you are speaking to those on PT, you may want to copy your comment and (try to) post it over there. Don’t be surprised if it is deleted though!
August 19, 2007 at 11:28 am
Rebecca
Yes, Lazy Gardens has done it again. Only this time, I agree with her!
I’ve read Raisinberry’s post on PT, about MK will be Great in 2008, feeling the let down.
Excerpts:
“You extended yourself way overboard to get to Seminar, after placing that sizeable order in June. …….. Holiday is bearing down your back, and you still have to unload thousands of dollars worth already collecting dust. How many boxes do you have that you didn’t even open yet?…….
You sell better than anyone in your Unit and your sales are meager. Your expenses are high. You have plowed money into this “opportunity”……. you are once again topping off production with resources you do not have, asking your hubby if he has any “space” on his card, …….
You know what you do to survive. …..
End excerpts.
Uh, hello? Poor money management. Ordering more than she sells. Expenses are too high. What would Lazy Gardens advise?
LG made a comment #51, in the thread to someone who claims to be a Caddi director and just worn out and wants to quit but needs to replace her MK income, “How about making the lifestyle fit the income you can earn outside Mary Kay … whatever that may be. I’m watching co-workers lose their houses to foreclosure because their lifestyles were “living up to their income” and when the income dropped they didn’t have any margin.”
Uh, hello? PT directors - lower your expenses. Make your lifestyle fit your income - Lazy Gardens says so.
“you are once again topping off production with resources you do not have, asking your hubby if he has any “space” on his card”, in RB’s post. Uh, read what LG wrote. If you are a Caddi director and you keep doing this, get a clue. You are NOT making Caddi production, you are buying it. Be a profitable Premier Club director instead of a debt riddled Caddi director.
My translation of LG’s advice, don’t spend every penny of your income. Save some for emergencies. In the case of MK directors, save some for those months when your commissions are lower, or lowest.
To the Caddi director referred to above: Take LG’s advice and apply it to your MK business. (See my translation above.)
All this to hang on to directorship? Is this not a clue that they need to step back, step down, be a consultant, or maybe even a Grand Achiever because they just are not making it as directors. Is this pride of theirs, that they just can’t admit they are not making it as directors, is this haughtiness that being a consultant is beneath them, MK, inc’s fault? No, it’s their own haughty spirit. Their own greed.
RB again, “You know what you do to survive.” That’s not surviving. That’s financial suicide. But I could also ask, “survive” what? If you are not a director anymore, you did not survive? That’s twisted.
September 5, 2007 at 6:01 pm
Jane MBA
One of the posts asks “why does anyone care what MK consultants, etc. make?” For ammunition, that’s why. I have a relative who NEVER shuts up about how great MK is, always pimping the stuff, “warm chattering” every where we go. Lord, give us all a break.
She makes ” a 6-figure income” as a Sales Director and only works part-time. Everything they have comes from MK, including that God-awful pink car (which she doesn’t drive anymore - hmmmm). Sure. Her poor husband apparently contributes zip to the household; everything is “my, mine, mine”. He, of course, never gets a word in about anything.
Met a lot of MK people thanks to her. All seem to neurotic narcissists. Very high school personalities: main topics of conversation are make-up, pedicures, false nails, botox (what about TimeWise?), boob jobs, unasked for advice about “needing a facial”, they never shut up. Most of them look like Tammy Faye Baker.
Come on - I have a Harvard MBA. Yeah, MK was taught at Harvard B-School, as an example of a MLM/pyramid type of business in a long line of case studies that were required. So can that schtick, please. Not something to brag about.
So, back to the “ammunition” reason: need something to interrupt the constant “warm chatter”; facts are nice and can’t be disputed. Love to throw them out at unexpected times. FYI: have yet to see the much-requested 1099. The MBA says: the numbers are not adding up. An MLM is an MLM. MKay is pink Amway. All come crashing down one day. Sorry folks; already starting to happen. Market saturation - move to foreign countries. Easy entry to a market equals low profits. Fundamental economics.
Please, oh please, leave the rest of us alone. Enough of the “warm blather”.
September 5, 2007 at 11:23 pm
MKBiz
Dear JaneMBA, Congratulations on your Harvard MBA, I wasn’t so fortunate I only graduated from a State College with a Bachelor’s. Don’t worry, I won’t warm chat you and I will still have a successful business and make a great income and love what I do.
I tend to enjoy being around fun people, not conceited people,
So you can breath easy. For the record, I do my own nails and tootsies, I hate needles so Botox isn’t an option, my boobs are real and fortunately even at my age haven’t started to sag yet, hips have started to spread a bit, and when I have my grandchildren with me people think they are my kids, not my grandkids.
For the record, I have met alot of neurotic narcissits not in Mary Kay too.
I will leave you alone, and why don’t you do just the same!!
September 6, 2007 at 6:26 am
PINK BREN
Jane, you should not lump eveyone in the MK that you are lumping. I have my own boobs, I will not get botox, yes I have my nails done I own a salon. I wish that the people that don’t like Mk would leave it alone. If you don’t like that is fine and dandy however why trash it.
Glad you have a MBA from Havard I am sure you worked hard for it the same way that most in MK do. They work hard to acheive their goals. You are warm chattering your MBA as you type this little post that you typed. If you don’t like MK or the people in MK then don’t go around them.
My question to you is what does it matter to you if you don’t like it? So many haters of something they don’t even understand or try to understand and if you think that it is going to fall by people like you, you might rethink that. I think that you haters are just jealous maybe you were in MK and it didn’t work for you are maybe not either way why don’t you keep your negative opinions to yourself.
I LOVE MK, I LOVE MY BUSINESS AND I WILL CONTINUE TO DO IT.
One more thing I don’t look like Tammy Faye.
September 6, 2007 at 9:05 am
foreverpink
jane do you make a six figure income with your MBA? And who cares about whether or not you like the personalities of the women in MK that you have met. The thing that matters is that this business works and it IS possible to make money at it, afterall you admitted it yourself when you say your relative makes six figures. Looks like to me you just proved our point. Whether or not your relative still has the caddie or not is irrelevant. In fact, many of the things that you complain about have nothing to do with the actual debate that we have been having amoungst these blogs.
But thanks for posting anyway
September 7, 2007 at 12:10 am
Rebecca
I can’t figure out what Jane MBA’s point is. And no, she ain’t gonna ever see that thar 1099. NOYB. None Of Your Business. Seems to me like Jane MBA is just spouting a lot of anti-MK “blather”.
But then I ain’t got me no call-edge edge-u-ca-shun so what do I know? All I got me is a fair to middlin’ amount of horse sense.
September 7, 2007 at 8:42 am
Jane MBA
Sorry to hit such a sensitive nerve, but now you have an inkling of how the rest of the world feels when we are subtly, and more often not so subtly, looked upon and commented upon as blind to the benefits of MK.
Most of you that I encountered never shut up about MK. Blatant attempts to change the conversation topic are ignored, and no opportunity to tout the wonderful lifestyle MK affords is passed up. Ever. You need to look at the body language of those around you; most are not interested.
I have a technical career, and if asked, I will talk about it for a short period of time. But, I realize most are not deeply interested in what I do, and after a polite discussion, I drop it. If people are really interested, they will ask more questions, but social cues let me know when to move on and not pin anyone to the wall with details of what to me is a fascinating profession with many benefits, with yes, a 6-figure income. No, not part-time. No 6-figure salary comes with less than 40 hours a week. I, too, get bonuses, and some added perks: health insurance, retirement plan, and steady pay.
1. True, I am complaining. However, I cannot avoid this close relative and her hordes of MK friends. She basically has a good heart, and the women I have met are not bad people either. I mention this because many, if not most of the MK reps need to polish their image beyond the perfect make-up.
2. Mention MK to a non-member of the MK group, and most will moan and give an eye-roll. Shades of AmWay and HerbaLife. Sorry, but I’ve experimented with this some, and it never fails. That is why you should be concerned about the image of a MK rep as a marathon talker, high-school-ish, and one-dimensional, which is not business-like at all and does nothing to further your cause. You, foreverpink, had better care very much whether or not I like the women in MK, since I spend the money. And, the disappearance of the Cadillac is very relavent, since that is one of the covetted benefits. I know you can lose it, and looks like she has. She claims to make 6-figures, but things seem a little tight - they are dipping into the IRA (before age 59 1/2) to make ends meet. Bad sign: eating the seed corn. How many other SDs are in this same boat? Moving up in the organization is based on how much you purchase, not how much you sell. She has a huge inventory, which is not moving.
3. I agree that someone’s 1099 is none of my business, unless I ask for documentation to back up the claims of the easy money before I jump on the bandwagon. Promises and the occasional glimpse of an old commission check is just not enough proof for me to tell Boeing, Inc. good-bye. Good business sense means checking the facts and figures before you sign on.
4. I apologize for dumping all MK people into the same pot; that was unfair. Just giving my observations of the whole thing from where I sit. Also, just pointing out that my background and training tell me that facts are facts: MLMs will eventually topple; the only ones who will survive are the ones on top, the very top, not the consultants and the SDs.
5. Rebecca, Rebecca. There you go, proving my point about high school behavior.
I will not post again. Very rude of me to question what you so passionately believe in. It is no business of mine what you do unless you try to make it my business, which many of you do by constantly pimping the stuff after I have stated repeatedly that I am not interested and could we change the subject. My pink stuff is Oil of Olay: cheaper and better.
Good luck to you all. I truly hope it is working for you and continues to do so.
September 7, 2007 at 10:09 am
Dana
“Most of you that I encountered never shut up about MK. Blatant attempts to change the conversation topic are ignored, and no opportunity to tout the wonderful lifestyle MK affords is passed up. Ever. You need to look at the body language of those around you; most are not interested. ”
I hate when people say this. “Most of you…” No, some of us do this, and give those of us a bad reputation. You cannot say it is “most” because those who do Mary Kay and don’t talk about it do not equal into your equation. Just because the ones you encounter that you know are Mary Kay sales reps do it does not mean it’s indicative of all Mary Kay reps. You could potentially know many reps and not even realize that they are reps because they don’t talk about it. I generally talk about it if someone brings it up (they saw my bumper sticker, they notice I use a lot of Mary Kay, etc.). And even then, I keep it brief.
September 7, 2007 at 10:29 am
anonymous
Jane MBA,
I’ve resisted the urge to respond to you until now. But you have me all riled up again, so you get to read my rant.
I AM college educated from a top-tier liberal arts college. Before MK, I had a great job in Washington DC and was headed to law school. In fact, Harvard & UVA were my top 2 choices (so you can see, I’m not dumb and I do have the ability to play with the big boys & girls at the best schools). As a litigation legal assistant (aka paralegal), I was one of the top billers in my firm (one of the largest in DC). I worked on ALL of the high profile cases and spent most of my time working on trials. When I wasn’t doing that, I was working on Supreme Court stuff. All of the attorneys I worked for were Harvard & Yale educated.
BUT when I took a look at my life, there wasn’t much of it. I worked around the clock (you’ve got to if you’re going to be one of the top producers at the firm as a legal assistant). I was required to work holidays and I’m not talking about the minor ones, I’m talking about Christmas, Thanksgiving. That sucked. To say I really had no life balance would be an understatement.
At the ripe old age of 26, I ended up in the hospital with chest pains. I thought I was having a heart attack. I wasn’t. It was stress. I was 26. Did I mention that part?
So I started to take a cold hard look at my life. Where was it headed? What could I do to bring more balance into my life? The fact was that I didn’t want to be a legal assistant anymore. In the five years I did it, I had done everything there was to do. That thing I kept hitting my head against, was the glass ceiling. So then I thought about law school. That had always been the plan. A couple of years in a DC firm to get some experience and then off to law school and then back to a corporate firm (I already knew which one). But I looked around. The lawyers weren’t any happier than I was. But they couldn’t leave. They had HUGE debt from law school. They never saw their families. One of my friends put her daughters to bed every night over the phone. She had duplicates of the books they loved in her desk and she would call and read to them over the phone. That wasn’t the life I wanted. That was no life at all.
So what else did I want to do? Well, I’d always wanted to be my own boss. But I knew from doing research into the things I wanted to do that it was expensive. The hours wouldn’t necessarily be any better, but the pay would initially be worse.
And then I remembered MK. I started my MK business very part-time while I held onto my full-time job (now a new job in management). I worked my business consistently, but slowly. I knew what I was getting into and why. I knew that I could not leave my full-time gig until I was making enough to support myself on my MK.
And that’s exactly what I did. I eventually left my full-time job and now I do MK exclusively. I am single, so there’s no one else supporting me.
I do not look like Tammy Faye Baker. I do not push people. I listen and when the word no is said, I take it for what it’s worth. I have some friends and family members who are MK clients and some who are not. For those who are not, I do not bug them about MK and do not talk about it unless they ask. But when someone says “how was work today?” I answer. I do not talk about myself 100% of the time. In fact, despite being a very high I, I dislike talking about myself at all.
I am very educated on world and national events and issues. I am active in politics (have worked on national, state, and local campaigns as paid staff and in volunteer capacities). I volunteer a lot in my community. And I help care for my dying grandmother and my disabled mom.
I do not know consultants who only speak of make-up and getting their nails done. Oh, I do get my nails done, but I did that when I worked in corporate America too. We aren’t catty and we would give the shirts off our back to support other people.
I could continue, but I really don’t need to defend myself or other consultants to you anymore.
You may be Harvard educated, but they obviously don’t teach anything about stereotyping or manners there.
I wish you could find some joy in your life. You sound as bitter as I used to be.
September 7, 2007 at 10:54 am
anonymous
One more thing Jane MBA . . . are you familar with Gloria Mayfield Banks? She’s got a HARVARD MBA just like you. And her success in MK has resulted in lots of recognition for her from the greater business world. Google her, ignore what you find on PT, and you’ll find out all about how successful she is and how she’s taught other women to be just as successful.
And about that car question you have about your relative losing her Cadillac. MAYBE she chose to take the cash instead. OR MAYBE she looked at her unit and was more concerned with building the women in her unit to be the best they could be and didn’t want to focus on production, so she moved to the Grand Prix and is a very successful Grand Prix driver.
The bottom line is you don’t know. So stop speculating. Your gossip and speculation about it are just as high schoolish as you accuse us of being.
Now I’m done.
September 7, 2007 at 11:27 am
Colleen
Anonymous please tell me (I live in the DC are) I live in PG county in MD.
If you think that there are a lot of consultnats in DC. I KNOW there are directors in MD the only Nationals I know of in this area are Kirk B Gillespie,
Kathy Rasmussen and Joyce Grady and I think there are 2 more but they are in MD and VA. I think that MK has never gotten big in Washington DC.
I think there are only 10 directors if that in Washington DC. Have you sold in that area?
September 7, 2007 at 11:58 am
anonymous
Colleen, I personally know over 1/2 dozen directors in DC. I’m no longer there, but I know dozens of consultants there including some in PG County.
Yes, I started my business in DC and it still thrives. I don’t live there now, but still have a lot of consultants there. My director is there and we are a Cadillac unit (with no co-payments).
Let’s put it this way, with 4 Nationals (you forgot Gloria Mayfield Banks - she’s in either Baltimore or Columbia, MD), there MUST be more than 10 directors. I promise you. I don’t remember if there’s a 5th National there or not, but Pam Tull isn’t far away in Delaware.
The DC area isn’t hurting for consultants or directors, but I don’t think it’s overrun either.
September 7, 2007 at 12:05 pm
mkhonesty
The point about Lazy Gardens is that as a regular contributor and maven on Pink Truth, LG isn’t qualified to make the judgments and conclusions that she does. Per her website http://lazygardens.wordpress.com/, LG is a “Certified Desert Landscaper”, which is a designation earned after attending 120 hours of training (one 4-hour class per week for 30 weeks) at the Desert Botanical Garden in Phoenix. Tuition is $1,265 plus approx $75 for incidentals. The course topics are listed here http://desertbotanical.org/index.aspx?pageID=328 , and there is no mention of business basics, financial accountability, tax preparation, or inventory management.
Jane, I won’t question your credentials. Trying to prove anonymous bonafides is like whores arguing about virginity, or comparing rank among ensigns. Sounds to me like you’re just not a “people person” or a risk-taker. When you go into a department store, do you wave off the sales clerk, hunt around yourself looking for what you want, and then complain to your friends about the poor customer service? Sounds like you’re happy to be the cubical-dwelling number-cruncher, the bean-counter, the well-grounded financial analyst who does her best to try to bring the high-flying marketing and sales types back to earth and the “real world” of ROI.
Assuming that you are on the technical side of finance and business, you know that a 1099 does not show the whole picture, especially since it does not show a consultant’s personal sales. A Sch C would be better, but all it shows is a one-year snapshot of a business. I keep the records for my wife’s business and work closely with our tax preparer to grab every penny of every deduction I can, and the IRS hasn’t complained yet. But you should know that, as every business, from one-person to major corporation, does exactly the same thing. In fact, the IRS allows a person filing a Sch C to show a loss in five of the first seven years of a business. (Note that’s “show a loss” not “fraudulently claim excessive deductions in order to shelter other income.) So a Sch C does not prove or disprove business performance. (Don’t ask me for a bullet-proof method for determing the future success of a business by examining records of past-performance. If I could, I’d be making a killing in the stock market, and I certainly wouldn’t be telling anyone else how I’m doing it!)
I can think of several reasons that the pink Cadillac is not in your close relative’s driveway anymore. Perhaps she wants the $900/month cash instead, for a myriad of reasons. Have you asked her?
I got an idea. Why don’t you invite your “close relative” to visit this blog? We’d all love to hear her side first-person, not second- or third-hand, and I’m sure she’d love to read your comments about her.
September 7, 2007 at 2:16 pm
foreverpink
Jane MBA says,
“Sorry to hit such a sensitive nerve, but now you have an inkling of how the rest of the world feels when we are subtly, and more often not so subtly, looked upon and commented upon as blind to the benefits of MK.”
I have to disagree Jane. We only know how YOU feel. That does not have to mean that the rest of the world feels this way. That may be how it is in your little corner of the world, but you have to realize that consultants and public opinion may vary from place to place. Please dont generalize. MK is a world wide corporation, there is bound to be somebody out there who DOES NOT feel the way you do.
Jane also says,
“You, foreverpink, had better care very much whether or not I like the women in MK, since I spend the money. And, the disappearance of the Cadillac is very relavent, since that is one of the covetted benefits. I know you can lose it, and looks like she has.”
I disagree again Jane, only because I think you misunderstood my statement. I was saying that it does not matter if you like these women or not for purposes of the conversation that was going on in this particular thread. The main argument that anti mk folks spout is that NO ONE is making any money selling MK and that no one will buy it. You said yourself that your relative makes six figures. I know of many directors who make six figures as well. So we are not talking about if you like someone or not, that is not the question.( talk about high school concerns). The question is can you make any money at this and the answer is YES. No one is going to like everyone all of the time. We are all human. You going on and on about how petty they are because they talk about getting their nails done etc..only makes you look like the high school one.
As far as the caddy goes, the reason I say it is irrelevant is because, as others have stated, there are several reasons why she may not have it anymore. The caddilac is not the only symbol of success in the biz. It is common knowledge that you have to qualify for each car, so the fact that you know one can loose it is no biggie. But if she is a sales director she is probably driving one of the other cars or maybe she took the cash. If she talks about MK so much, why dont you ask her next time instead of assuming that something must be wrong or thay she isnt doing that well in her business. Afterall I am sure you will have plenty of opportunity to do so since you say you cant get away from her and she will never “shut up about MK.” But as far as us being concerned about you liking us because you spend the money, well it really would’nt matter in your case because you have already said that you would rather buy oil of olay, so no big loss there. We cant please everyone. Its your choice.
Jane also says:
“MLMs will eventually topple”. Well Jane, we agree on something. I believe this too. As a matter of fact I have lived long enough to see some MLM’s come and go. They start out with lost of folks signing up and then after a few years you dont hear about them anymore. Maybe some still exist in other forms or maybe they hover around the internet, but they never regain the speed they once had. But even you can admit that MK is not like that. We are still here after 40 years. We have outlived every other MLM set up out there. Our marketing is set up differently than the Amways and the Herbalife’s of the world. You say you know about MK being taught in Harvard B school as one of the types of MLM’s. Well then you should know what makes us different from the rest. There is a reason why we have lasted this long and it isnt because we buy our way to the top. If no one was interested (end using customers), MK would have toppled a long time ago.
Jane I know you dont want to hear all of this, but you opened yourself up for this dialog when you posted. So you cant really accuse us of imposing upon you just to tell you about MK or “making it your business” by talking about it to you. You posted your comments, part of which were very insulting, so you had to be prepared for us to make counter arguments. Or maybe you thought that none of us would respond. I dont know. But it is kind of puzzeling that you would even be lurking on blogs about MK since you are so sick of hearing about it from your relative.
Here is a thought, why dont you just tell your relative that you want her to stop pushing her business on to you? Have you asked her to stop this behavior? Why dont you tell her the things that you have shared with us? Or excuse yourself the next time she is having a conversation with someone else about MK if you can.
We know that there are changes that need to be made to this company, but that doesnt change the basic concepts. And they are that plenty of folks love this product. They are fun to sell and use. I get compliments on my makeup frequently, and NO we dont all look like Tammy Faye Baker(God rest her soul). The business plan works when done properly. We wont all get rich but you can make money, as I do. You dont have to like it, but dont knock others who do.
September 7, 2007 at 2:34 pm
Rebecca
“High school behavior.” Really? No. Jane MBA, dear, what I am is fed up with people with an MBA (some, not all, probably just a tiny few), or some college degree, treating me and other MK people as if we aren’t smart enough to figure out which way is up without your pointing it out to us.
I don’t know about the people that are in Jane MBA’s life, so I’ll not speak for them, nor for that specific situation. Other than to say that perhaps Jane MBA needs to have an honest chat with her relative and tactfully tell her to shut up about MK already.
As for the rest of us MK people, yeah, some get really enthusiastic and even carried away at times. But we are all adults, grown ups, and we already do know how to read body language. In fact, we even discuss how to read body language in DISC training, warm chatter training, recruiting training, booking training, etc., etc., etc.
I truly detest Jane MBA’s (and those few others like her) snotty, superior, hoity-toity, holier-than-thou, way of speaking to the rest of us.
Talk down to me, Jane MBA, dear, as if I am a child, and childish behavior is what you will get. Talk in an adult and respectful manner, and the responses you get will be adult and respectful. Let me toss in there intelligent, too. Adult, respectful, intelligent. Not having an MBA does not mean one is not